2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

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Kiwi
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Kiwi » Fri May 03, 2013 8:40 pm

Higpup wrote:that first number is the the RACE# not the date. :mrgreen:
well, I need new glasses, thanks ::):

Sebastian Scott
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Sebastian Scott » Sat May 11, 2013 1:15 am

Last edited by Sebastian Scott on Sat May 11, 2013 6:23 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Josf
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Josf » Sat May 11, 2013 2:27 am

Sebastian,

The link links to the Bahrain Race Results (on my end).

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Higpup
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Higpup » Sat May 11, 2013 7:16 am

For some reason I was about 1 second of my pace from mid week. I ran a 119.8 with about 40 L of fuel mid week, but couldn't even touch that time on Friday.
My race start was ok, qualed in 5th, but had a 5 spot penalty from last race. Going into turn 4 Jeff slowed more than I expected and I took evasive action to the left and ran off track. After that I didn't make any more mistakes. I just pounded around saving tires and staying on the track. Was trying to catch Otto, but with a few laps to go I saw him off track in the up hill turn 7-8, so I got 3rd almost a lap down. I just couldn't get the speed out of the car on Friday.

One thing I would like to mention, when guys are getting lapped, please do not slow down on the racing line. If you're going to slow down do it off line. A few guys slowed down on line and then looked like they pulled their car off track a bit, not sure if that was on purpose or just happened. Slowing down at all on line, is a crash waiting to happen. I'm not calling anyone out, just pointing a situation out that has the potential to cause an accident.
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Josf
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Josf » Sat May 11, 2013 10:19 am

I went through the replay looking for me slowing down on the racing line, so as to make sure it was not me. I then looked at the whole race from Sean's view, to make sure it was not me. I saw no case of poor driving, so I have no idea what constitutes this potential cause for a potential accident caused by the slower driver.

I do know that I must brake on the racing line, failing to brake on the racing line will result in going off-line, or off track, and I do know that often is the case that I am hit from behind while I am braking where I need to brake on the racing line, slower cars are slower cars on the racing line, faster cars are faster on the racing line, and therefore I get off the racing line, and sometimes off the track, to avoid another incident of being hit from behind by someone driving through me.

I would like to see, and save, examples of someone on the racing line where cars are supposed to be accelerating and where the slower car may jam on the brakes in front of a faster car on that racing line where cars normally accelerate, so as to have such things shown as examples of less than perfect methods where slower cars deal with faster cars, and where faster cars deal with slower cars.

I prefer to be informed of cases where I may be driving poorly. I may not agree as to who is at fault, and where these replays are recorded the actual incident could be what it is, and not subject to my opinion. That is my view of such things involving cases where drivers can communicate incidents where driving can be improved and racing can be improved, and we can all compete and have fun.

While on that subject, and not as a method of claiming that anyone should be penalized, my car was spun around during the race, while I was off the racing line, moving over, trying to brake soon enough, off-line, having to brake more than I would brake if I were on the racing line, and even so, even while getting off line, out of the way, I was hit anyway.

At some point the slower cars have to get off the track or be hit, obviously, measurably, and often enough to prove the fact to be a fact. A similar incident occurred, case in point, again in practice, only I was not, in that case, moving over, it was not the actual race, it was practice, I was braking where I should brake, on the racing line, in the braking zone, a car was behind me, at the apex of turn 10 the car behind hit me, and I spun around as a result of that hit by the faster car behind the slower car. The only way I can avoid such a thing happening, again, and again, and again, is what?

I'd like to know.

Monaco leaves little room for getting out of the way other than the choice to stay in the pits or stay off the server.

I could think that my viewpoint is just me, the odd ball, sure, but when I read the past messages on this forum I read, more than once, other drivers reporting incidents of being hit from behind, and I can cut and paste those reports if anyone has any interest in such things at all.

I would not bring this up, at all, except that it is being brought up, is it not?

The race was fun, there were incidents, I was in one, what can I do to avoid being in another one? My driving has been incident free in many races, and my driving has been slow, but consistent, and improving. How can I possibly avoid another incident?

Really, I'd like to know. Show me this incident where a slower driver is driving poorly, by any measure, since most incidents I've seen have been drivers driving through the slower cars. I can show those incidents easy enough, because they happen often enough.

Please don't get me wrong here, the racing is very challenging, worth the effort, and a lot of fun.

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Josf
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Josf » Sat May 11, 2013 10:36 am

I saw Alaster before the race, and we were both on the server at the same time. I am wondering about something concerning his absence during the Race. While looking at replays I noticed my selected car was the car with Alaster named as the driver of that car. Now I'm wondering if some time between Alaster and I being on the server at the same time, between that time and the Race, if in that time period I somehow selected the wrong car, and in so doing Alaster was not able to join the Race?

Alaster was chatting before the race and he said that Sauber was going to finish in the podium.

Otto Acosta
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Otto Acosta » Sat May 11, 2013 11:09 am

We had a good enough car to finish on the podium, we were running 3rd with 11 laps to go and keeping the gap back to Sean manageable but made a mistake at the chicane on the second sector, hit the wall, made it back to the pits but it was going to take over 1 minute to fix the damages so decided to bag it for the night. The error really surprised me as I was on my own, had good rhythm going and mistakes are very rare, normally, that late in the race.

These cars are so tricky under breaking that, at least for me, with the little practice I can get in it is almost impossible to have a clean lap, let alone keeping it clean for the entire race.

Congrats to Stuff for the win and to Glyn and Sean for their podium finishes.

I will try my best to be at Monaco so hope to see you all then.
"To finish first, you first have to finish" - Mario Andretti

Sebastian Scott
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Sebastian Scott » Sat May 11, 2013 12:19 pm

Was a eventful and fun race.

Q: Had some good pace in Q1 but opted out in Q2 due to my tires melting under full fuel.

R: Got a good start but ended up being the meat in a Glyn and Otto sandwich when the gap I was in closed. Got damage to the front right which caused a few issues with an off on the first lap.

From last, I proceeded to chase the pack down, which resulted in two stupid moments from me in about 3 laps. 1: hammering up the back of Josf into the hairpin at the start of S2. Sorry about that Josf, there was a big misjudgement from me and I hope it doesn't happen again! 2: nudging John at the start of the main straight. Sorry for the tap El Capt....

Post that, nothing major happened, just me cruising around on my own and making mistakes. The fun kicked in when I came out of the pits on L32 with Jeff and Juice 14secs down the road and thought I'd have a go at catching them as they seemed to be battling for 5th and their times were a little down. Managed to get past round L41ish. Then into nursing the tires home, however it turned out I miss calculated how many laps were left and pitted with one lap left. What an idiot!
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Josf
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Josf » Sat May 11, 2013 1:24 pm

I saw the Glyn and Otto sandwich on replay, and thought it was amazing.

The incident involving me could have been much worse, the car appeared to suffer only cosmetic damage, and as it turned out my fight to catch John ended when he spun at turn 7, so the delay amounted to no change in my finishing order, and therefore no change in points. I appreciate the reply, and again my point is not to demand any penalties, it was a racing incident. My guess is that you thought I'd return to the racing line so you went for the inside as I moved too far off the track first, moving too early to give up the position, then moving back onto the track to salvage some time, and salvage some entry angle into turn 5 I moved to the middle of the track. From my end I was thinking that I left plenty of room on the outside, and my thinking was to brake soon enough to avoid my car occupying the apex at the same time you would be on that racing line. My telegraphing of intentions could be improved, and that may help in avoiding a repeat.

It is not easy to judge and drive a line that is competitive enough to race someone remotely the same speed as I am and at the same time avoid being in the way of those who are considerably faster. I do notice, on the other hand, much effective judging, and driving, done by those few who I do pass, in almost all of those rare cases. It does take two to tango, or three in a sandwich, or threaded a needle.

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Higpup
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Higpup » Sat May 11, 2013 3:50 pm

Josf wrote:I went through the replay looking for me slowing down on the racing line, so as to make sure it was not me. I then looked at the whole race from Sean's view, to make sure it was not me. I saw no case of poor driving, so I have no idea what constitutes this potential cause for a potential accident caused by the slower driver. .
I didn't mention anything about poor driving.

I do know that I must brake on the racing line, failing to brake on the racing line will result in going off-line
This is why I don't respond too much to what you type. You are taking what I said to the extreme, and past the point of common sense.
I would like to see, and save, examples of someone on the racing line where cars are supposed to be accelerating and where the slower car may jam on the brakes in front of a faster car on that racing line where cars normally accelerate, so as to have such things shown as examples of less than perfect methods where slower cars deal with faster cars, and where faster cars deal with slower cars.

I never said anything about slamming on brakes when cars are supposed to be accelerating. Again you're taking what I said and adding your own take.


While on that subject, and not as a method of claiming that anyone should be penalized, my car was spun around during the race, while I was off the racing line, moving over, trying to brake soon enough, off-line, having to brake more than I would brake if I were on the racing line, and even so, even while getting off line, out of the way, I was hit anyway.
You failed to mention that you were in the grass just before this incident and then went to the middle of the track, then back to the left and slowed down more than what the driver behind probably expected you to do.
At some point the slower cars have to get off the track or be hit, obviously, measurably, and often enough to prove the fact to be a fact.
Driving off track? Why would drive off track? That, to me, just adds another unknown to the driver behind. Did you go off on accident and are coming back on? EXAMPLE: Lap 33, you in turn 14-15. I didn't know what the heck you were doing. I thought you missed the corner and might turn back right.
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JohnW
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by JohnW » Sat May 11, 2013 5:31 pm

Josf,

Yes, you were spun, and the driver responsible will be called on the carpet and very likely penalized for doing so. Some guys over take other drivers better than some, and some drivers make overtaking, under the blue flag for instance, much smoother than others. However, none of us do it correctly every single time. I've been driving with a blue flag appearing on my screen as long as we have been online racing. You'd think I would be an expert by now. Even still, I sometimes mess it up.

Getting passed successfully is easy.

1 Drive your line and speed until the blue flag comes out.

2 Consider the next sections of the race track and determine where a GOOD and OBVIOUS place to move off the line will be and after doing so, decrease your speed just enough to allow an easy pass. To be honest, you should not be surprised by a blue flag and be thinking ahead when you see the car getting bigger in the mirrors before the flag comes out.

3 Return to race speed.

Anything that appears erratic or sudden changes in speed will confuse the driver trying to pass. Don't do anything the guy behind you would not expect.

On the flip side, drivers making the pass should NOT be right on the rear wing of the car in front. You won't have enough time to react when they move over. I have seen cars follow the slower car right off the line, because they are fixated on the car and not the track, and THEN get surprised when they lift off the throttle. Give the slower guy a CHANCE to make his intentions known and THEN go on by when they give you the line.
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Alaster
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Alaster » Sat May 11, 2013 5:36 pm

Sorry I missed the race, there was a power outage in my location. Too bad, as I was very happy with my preparation and was confident about my pace. Anyway congrats to Stuff and see you guys next round.
YOU MUST CONQUER THE WILD COUNTRY TO WIN THE RACE FOREVER!

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Josf
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Josf » Sat May 11, 2013 5:40 pm

John,

I've had the order for me to shut up handed down to me already, so I have to be careful at this point.

I can say, I suppose, that I did not start this new round of one way communication.

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Higpup
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by Higpup » Sat May 11, 2013 6:04 pm

Josf wrote:John,

I've had the order for me to shut up handed down to me already, so I have to be careful at this point.

I can say, I suppose, that I did not start this new round of one way communication.

Order to shut up? I guess that means this conversation is over?
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Re: 2013 ROUND 5: Spain Pre/Post Race

Post by JohnW » Sat May 11, 2013 8:31 pm

Josf,

You're not being reasonable. Sorry, but your not. There are no orders around here. Communication is not just one way. I think I've made that clear in our previous conversations.
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